With Macross Delta coming some time in the future, maybe late 2015 or 2016, I felt it was a good time to watch Macross Frontier again. The last time I watched it was at the end of 2011 so it’s been a while. Overall watching it this time around was a good experience despite being disgusted at the first movie so much I didn’t bother with the second. For that reason I will be mostly talking about the TV series and bringing up the biggest points I’d like to discuss from what I saw.
Most of you probably know this already or can just tell by looking at my site but I am a major Ranka fan, I do my best to be upfront about when I am being biased about it though. Despite having a Ranka-minded perspective I do try to make sure what I say is correct. I know in the past I have written some things about Frontier that I was mistaken about, this is another reason I am writing this post. With Frontier fresh in my mind I can revisit these points again and add in new perspectives.
Table of Contents
- General thoughts on animation, music and plot
- Ranking my favorite episodes
- Sheryl vs Ranka the clash of two paradigms
- The love triangle, why did no one notice the trolling
- On Ranka leaving Frontier in episode 21
- Sheryl’s role in Frontier
- One note on the Macross movies aka everyone loves Sheryl
- Alto and his wings revisited
- Final thoughts
General thoughts on animation, music and plot
I think the Macross Frontier TV series has aged fairly well. I still think the animation while sometimes inconsistent overall is very impressive to me for a 7-year-old series. The mechas in particular are gorgeous and it feels like they put a lot of effort into almost any scene that does not have people in it. Granted I am fairly bad at discerning quality animation this is just my impression.
Of course the music is as amazing as always. I think this time around the background music stood out to me more, it’s something you may not notice but is very important in any anime. Yoko Kanno does a great job whether its setting the atmosphere for two people talking in Griffith park or idols singing their hearts out in the climax of the final battle.
The one thing I find hurts the re-watch-ability factor though is once you know what the Vajra are pretty much all the battle scenes feel so tragic. Grace more or less unleashes these two sides on each other that are so different they can’t understand one other or work together until the very end. I can’t really get excited about seeing the Vajra being blown up knowing all this. One of the few areas the movies might be better off in since the Vajra are less focused even though it’s more or less what makes Frontier Frontier.
However despite this I think the coolest thing as a Ranka fan to see was to see what Ranka became in episode 25. The Vajra whom the Protoculture feared, whom everyone wanted to harness its power but couldn’t and even Grace who took over control of the queen at the end, none of this held a candle to the little queen’s voice. Her song literally saved the universe at it’s biggest crisis yet in the Macross timeline. The power of song indeed.
Ranking my favorite episodes
This is pretty straight forward, a list of my favorite episodes. This is purely on personal enjoyment here.
10. episode 2 – While it is somewhat a filler to round out the top 10 it had a nice conclusion to a great episode 1 and set things up nicely for episode 3 to set in motion the fates of the main characters.
9. episode 14 – If the series had stopped at episode 14 I would be okay with this. Honestly the second half dragged on and started focusing on certain plot points I didn’t really like at all. However this was great conclusion to the first half with an exciting battle and Ranka managed to execute the Minmay defense all on her own.
8. episode 13 – The Ranka and Alto moments in this episode were cute and felt natural which a nice change of pace to the angst or forced advances that sometimes annoyed me in this love triangle. We also got some nice development in some of the major plot lines in this series, I believe this is when the idea of the little queen was first brought up.
7. episode 3 – Much like episode 13 I liked the last scene with Alto and Ranka. It wasn’t so much as it had to be them but I felt if anything the meaning behind that scene was so Macross it hurt. Aimo the love song sung once in ten thousand years to bring Vajra galaxies apart together sung to bring two souls together on their journey as they find their destinies. If you don’t believe me just look what they did to this scene in the movie and then what happened. Heck in the movie Sheryl even said Aimo was the song of fate.
6. episode 7 – I just really liked the battle sequence here with the first time Macross Quarter transforming and using its main cannon. Meanwhile Ranka helping Sheryl in concert and then using her little queen power to send their music through fold waves that helped give Alto strength in his battle.
5. episode 25 – I liked this episode more the last time I watched it, I guess in the end I feel like they screwed it up a bit by not having the love triangle end. There really was no reason not to story wise it was plain obvious Alto knew who he loved. I still wish Sheryl had been stronger in the end considering that was the thing she was characterized as having the most of. Just giving up most or less kills the idea of her being strong even in the face of certain death.
4. episode 1 – I’ve seen this episode so many times, I really think it is a perfect start to the series. Granted the deculture version is the best, most of the scenes they tacked on to the tv version felt unneeded and forced. Also nyan nyan nyan nyan nihao nyan gorgeous delicious deculture!
3. episode 21 – I am going to go over this more on its own but Ranka really was amazing in this episode even though it was so dark. I just can’t help but admire her for facing so many hard choices and doing the right thing whether it be singing or not singing.
2. episode 10 – I’m not sure if this overall was that great but as a Ranka fan how can I not help but love that moment when she goes from being a nobody to own her way to becoming a legend.
1. episode 12 – So much to love about this episode. Seikan Hikou? YES Ranka dropping from the sky onto a battlefield and saving the day? YES YES (someone getting karma from last episode, yes) That beautiful last scene of the vf-25 flying in the clouds and ending it with Do You Remember Love. Well you know, yes.
Sheryl vs Ranka the clash of two paradigms
While the Ranka and Sheryl rivalry is mostly known for being about singing, love and moe vs sexy I think there was a more interesting conflict at work here. This is a topic that goes beyond just Macross Frontier but it’s very apparent here so I want to talk about it a little. This is the clash between instant gratification and character development.
Fandom in general goes for that instant gratification in most things. First impressions drive what we think for the rest of the series. Characters that appeal to that first impression, that instant gratification, are almost always the most popular and thought of higher and thus given more leeway in criticism. In this sense Sheryl was designed to be the fan favorite, she is the Mary Sue who is in top form from the start who has popular traits like confidence and sex appeal. Ranka has her own good aspects that created an instant fandom too but is also very flawed and her story is focused in growth and discovery.
Even if Ranka is the underdog in popularity she has something far more valuable to me, potential. Flawed characters make for more interesting stories and gives more room to show growth and depth. Perfect characters can be fun and I enjoy them as much as the next person but they just have such a harder time working a place into my heart and tend to be very forgettable. To me a the best kind of hero is the one that becomes a hero and an inspiration not just is a hero.
To use an analogy what I’m talking about here is like the difference between buying an instant meal at the grocery store over cooking a nice meal for yourself. They both can taste good but that extra work you may not like has greater rewards. That really is the larger issue at play here not who I like more in Macross Frontier. I want fandom to not always go for that instant meal and let some things in anime cook before you decide what tastes better.
the love triangle, why did no one notice the trolling
This time around when watching Macross F I really tried to look beyond the love triangle and observe it more as a part of the entire story. The interesting thing is that I noticed a pattern worth mentioning when looking at it from this general perspective that being…HOW DID NO ONE NOTICE ALL THE TROLLING THEY DID WITH SHERYL AND ALTO. Lets just go over most of the major points that are often looked at in the story.
The first date with Sheryl and Alto in episode 5: Sure it looks like it’s all about them but if you pay attention Alto is rather looking for Ranka, he sees her and is forceful about going to exactly where she was going. Then you see some subtle shots of Alto looking around in the mall. On the surface its a good Sheryl Alto date but upon closer inspection Alto’s mind appears to be elsewhere.
End of episode 11: Again this looks really good for Sheryl, looks like Ranka is left behind and Sheryl is giving Alto the sky however the next episode Sheryl gets sick and Ranka comes in and saves the day and ends up instead in the skies with Alto. Now that is a troll.
End of episode 19: Once again looks good for the pair but as we see in the next episode it was just Sheryl falling over. Seems like something is going to happen but never does.
The Alto/Sheryl scene in episode 22: Probably the thing everyone thinks made Alto show he chose Sheryl along with the little “couples” thing they do the next episode. However if you actually listen to Sheryl she says several times he is just being nice to her and she’ll take it anyways. Sure she could be wrong but they definitely intended to show doubt into the idea Alto had picked Sheryl here aka fooling you once again.
End of episode 23: Not sure if this is really a troll but it is easy to take this as Alto picking to save Frontier over Ranka, not what he did though. Some people would say he saved Ranka just for Sheryl which is really wishful thinking. Why they would set it up as a guy who was always getting one upped by Brera over saving Ranka and who would finally save her when he doesn’t actually care anymore.
Episode 24 kiss scene: Well looks like Alto is trying to confess something to Sheryl but he never says anything, instead she releases him from the duty of staying with her until she dies and he goes and saves Ranka.
Macross F movies: Already did a whole post of how they flipped the girls roles in it however I think this was just part of the plan to build a better universe for Sheryl over the one where she thought she was all alone in. Still pretty sure the manner in which it was done was trollish especially with how alto disappears at the end.
Personally I always thought Sheryl just needed friends more than anything else, maybe that’s all she really wanted out of Alto. She never did flat-out say she loved him. I really have nothing more to say but if you really want to take the love triangle that seriously when it’s just troll after troll then I salute your dedication.
On Ranka leaving Frontier in episode 21
You know when Ranka left to go to the Vajra home world in episode 21 she got a lot of criticism and hate but yet to me it’s so beautiful and admirable that she does this. Macross has always been about finding peace between sides that don’t understand each other through song. Ranka was fulfilling the role that other Macross legends had done but in terms of people being able to understand this rationally it was poor timing due to all the bad things going on.
First off to address some of the criticism was it the best call she could have made about the situation? Easily yes, what else was she to do? She knew she had something that could possibly end the war and that the Vajra were not evil and that her memories were probably the key to clearing up the entire situation. Her choices were to go to Alto, Brera, Ozma and/or the SMS for help to do this. Ozma was MIA at the time and not to mention there was also the whole plot point of him talking about her finding her own path and not needing him anymore as she was becoming an adult.
As for the SMS, Brera was doing a better job protecting her all this time than the SMS, it was shown over and over again. So yes I don’t think Brera was a bad choice given the info she had. Finally when she went to Alto and Alto tried to kill Ai-kun without even listening to her she probably knew that others would have a similar reaction and it was up to her to stop this war. Brera was the one person who was listening to her the most so it makes sense to count on him to understand what she needed to do.
Once you set aside whether you think it was the right choice or not its really amazing for her to sacrifice everything including Alto to do the right thing. It would have been so easy for her to ignore the feelings she had and just sing anyways but we should not do things because they are easy but because they are the right thing to do.
I don’t really care whether or not it worked right, Ranka had no clue there were other enemies out there or that Brera had a mind control device on his head. The movie version conveniently showed Ranka the true enemies (and Brera was barely around) which is why she went to the SMS.
If you really want to blame someone I’d like to point out a few episodes ago Grace told Sheryl she was still infected with the virus and was going to die in a very evil way. Yet Sheryl never said anything about Grace to anyone, like even just warning to Ranka that maybe you shouldn’t trust your new manager. Possibly could have made her more weary of trusting Brera who worked under Grace or of flying off alone in just one Valkyrie. But I think most Ranka criticism (or anyone for that matter) can be sourced to what I said about that first impressions, it really changes your whole perspective on things.
Sheryl’s role in Frontier
In the past I’ve criticized how they used Sheryl in Macross F. Upon watching this again I think I was wrong to say she doesn’t have much worth as a main character however I do wish they had gone a different route with her. Her sickness did have some role after all, when singing at the end it showed the Vajra the differences in humans by contrasting it to Ranka so that’s something important. I also talked a bit before about the Alto mother connection as well that came from being sick. Still from an enjoyment perspective I dislike all the scenes where Sheryl was sick and the idea that she appears to use Alto to pretend to be her boyfriend at the end out of sympathy but that is more on Alto.
Probably the most important role she played was more of an antagonistic role she had with Ranka and Alto. Her advances in the love triangle and to a lesser extent her stardom are shown to give Ranka encouragement to grow and move forward either directly or indirectly. The same with Alto especially towards the end, it gave him goals and helped to clarify his feelings.
In the end I am not sure what else I could have done to give her importance. Perhaps turn her into a spy suspect and have people talk about whether she is spy for 2 hours while still disconnecting her from the real spies in a weird ambiguous way? Which would then go no where other than to show kind of subtly she was in on the evil plans all along but then just leave it at that which would leave you wondering why they spent so much time in the movies with this spy crap in the first place?
One note on the Macross movies aka everybody loves Sheryl
I don’t think there is much worth saying about the Macross Frontier movies however I feel like I understand better the reasoning behind the Ranka/Sheryl plot flip thing they did (see here for details). Sheryl in the TV universe was in a rather screwed over position, she was basically all alone until the very end. Thinking about it the movie universe was an attempt to make Sheryl more loved. Ranka, Grace and Alto all had their relationships with Sheryl altered and “improved” in order to meet this end. But also I’m sure they changed it for money, they created a Sheryl Nome official website and product line for crying out loud.
The Ranka and Sheryl relationship is very different, in the TV series they aren’t developed that much and more often are rivals that go against each other. In the movies they have a fairly positive relationship to the point where Ranka is more concerned about Sheryl in the end than Alto (it took me over 3 years to figure out why Ranka yelled out for Sheryl instead of Alto in the climax and this was probably it).
Grace also was redesigned from not caring one bit about Sheryl to being mind-controlled and her mother figure. This forced them to introduce new villains that I’m pretty sure no one ever cared about (they existed in the TV series more or less but as a very minor role). It was one of the bigger tragedies of the movie version because Grace works so much better as the main antagonist. There was no hint of her ever even caring one bit about Sheryl in the TV series and making her a good person just feels more like it’s coming from a perspective of a wishful Sheryl fan.
Alto of course we already know, fairly obvious to me how they changed him and what not. Also had the biggest impact on the plot requiring them to remove Ranka from a lot of things, add in things like Vajra mind control beams and making Alto take over as the Vajra peacemaker instead of Ranka. Had to make a Sheryl spy controversy in order to put her in the middle of things so she could be rescued and what not later on. Basically many of the major movie changes you can attribute to this mindset change.
One other important thing to note is that despite the movies seemingly created for Sheryl fans by Sheryl fans they also very subtlety showed that she knew at least some of the evil plans going on the whole time and did nothing until the very end for who knows why. I mean it is what it is however this has led some people to being upset with the idea that they rewrote a good story and rewarded a morally weak character just because she was popular.
Personally I am of the mindset that while I always love to see heroes rewarded like Ranka this just shows a true hero does not need a reward. A true hero does what they need to do because it is right. While I think Ranka deserved much better at least we know that our lady was amazing and has the strength in life to live it the right way and that inner strength will do more to make her happy than any man ever will.
Getting back to my original topic though like I’ve said before if you enjoy these movie its fine I don’t think there is anything wrong with liking them. I just see a false songstress version when I watch it (see what I did there). However, my main objective with the movies has always been just to bring awareness to the shady plot changes. I don’t like anyone getting away with such blatantly dishonest anime creating especially at the expense of my favorite character. Also creating content from a fan-minded perspective is bad, it hurts the potential of something greatly so you don’t know how much better this could have been if the main objective hadn’t been creating a Sherylverse.
Alto and his wings revisited
I wrote an article a while back on the meaning behind Alto’s wings. Personally I hate to reread my old stuff so this is going off of memory however I do think that I still agree with this theory more or less. At the very least Sheryl’s purpose was to help Alto accept who he was and is through being relate-able to his mother issues that haunted him. Meanwhile Ranka’s purpose was giving him the strength to chase his dreams by being the main reason he could fly. The flying, the skies, the paper plane and his mother are all very closely tied together as almost one thing so you could argue what aspects are tied to whom and such but I think what I said makes the most sense from how the story played out.
I do know I had some things wrong, Alto was unknowingly trying to prove himself to Ranka most of the series however Brera one upped him every time until the end. Most likely the point of this was to show he couldn’t protect someone when he was still running away. He was playing a role of solider and not being true to his feelings. That was why the Sheryl/Mother thing came in order to help him get over it so he could move forward and stop running. Which is why you would reason he was finally able to be worthy of Ranka in the final episode and saves her.
Final thoughts
Macross Frontier continues to be an important series to me, while it has its flaws it will likely be one of the most memorable series I will ever watch as an anime fan. Ranka’s story in particular I continue to consider wonderful and one of the main reasons I love Frontier. Also this time around I was happy I was finally able to sort out most of the major issues that had been bugging me which I more or less all brought up in this post. It’s disappointing that there are still other aspects about it I really can’t enjoy but at the same time I remembered the love in this series as well.
Philip Elthorpe said:
The ONE thing, and the ONLY thing, I can take from the movies, Reki, and I always have had…
Niji Iro Kuma Kuma.
It’s literally Ranka’s song. From practically nothing to a bubble pop princess, it’s like the story of Cinderella if she was auditioning to be a singer rather than going to the prince’s ball. She’s both the fairy and she’s Pastel The Magical Girl. She’s our star, and that’s the bottom line there.
Other than that, yes, Sheryl was a massive troll for the fans of Ranka, and even worse in the movies. At least, though, what we got other than that was epic.
Reki said:
yeah I’ve said before that Niji Iro Kuma Kuma is the only thing you need to see in the second movie. I’m pretty sure Ranka fans would have rioted so hard about the movies if that didn’t exist not to mention they would probably notice the BS they did with the plot more.
Philip Elthorpe said:
Hell, I’d take a version of Ranka who DEBUTED with Niji Iro Kuma Kuma in the series more than watching the second movie.
kaldar5 said:
Great job on the article, and props for going over the ep 21 choices.
Ranka made the hard choices to end the war, and was willing to give up everything to do it. That is true integrity and bravery with compassion. So many people miss what she was actually doing because of certain group’s subtitles and think it’s just to take Ai-kun home.
Would have worked too; but sometimes there is a espionage cyborg with the resources of an entire fleet working against you. Also, would have made for a lackluster ending.
—
Question: Do you feel better about “Battle Aimo” now? Yes I know it’s a twisting of Aimo for the wrong purposes, but still was cool at the time.
Reki said:
I wish I had done a better job praising Ranka’s decisions but it was hard to write about when there is so many different aspects to go over while trying to keep it simple enough to get the message across. Hopefully people understand though.
As for battle aimo I don’t like that Grace was the one that wrote it or at least came up with the idea for someone else to write. Twisted around Ranka’s song but I guess it was needed at the time since the other option was let the Vajra kill people. Plus Ranka was showing a lot of guts going into a battlefield with only a song to defend herself with (again), only other idol that has done this in Macross history is Basara I think.
Philip Elthorpe said:
Basara is different. He took the idea of pacifism through rock and roll to epic levels.
Ranka’s only weapon was that she was the little queen, her harmonics were like the food of the gods to the Vajra. When the movies diluted that, well…
Reki said:
Yeah I know Basara is not the exact same I just meant from the idea of putting himself in direct danger in a mecha with only a song to defend himself with is more or less what Ranka is doing as well. It’s a brave thing to do is my point.
I mean at least for the SMS and Ranka it was about defense even if it’s not pacifism even if others behind the scenes were wanting to control the Vajra.
rx card said:
Try to make the guest posts as amazing as possible by promoting and dropping links. I just shared your post on my Twitter. I just discovered your website but I’m at my school as I write this so I’ll have to read the rest of this later on when I get back home and I’m able to read it without distractions. Exceptionally well written article!
angelfox22 said:
Reading the bit about Aimo reminds me of something else regarding both series and movies. I know I mentioned this before but it’s worth mentioning again. That is Alto has a preference when it comes to the songs. In the series he is seen asking Ranka to sing and actively showing an interest in her songs. In fact he even willingly attended one of her concerts and is seen enjoying himself there. This even extends to when Alto is piloting. Often when Ranka is not signing Alto doesn’t come across as being all that special but as soon as Ranka starts singing Alto suddenly becomes amazing. This is really obvious during the final battle. Alto gets hit twice prior to Ranka singing. As soon as Ranka starts singing Alto is blazing through all the enemies with ease. However when it comes to Sheryl he isn’t shown as being that interested. Alto never really properly attended any of Sheryl’s concerts. He isn’t shown to be encouraged by her music during battles either. However the movies completely flips Alto’s music preferences. Very early on we see Alto happily watching a Sheryl concert. During battles it’s Sheryl’s songs which provide encouragement for Alto. You get the general idea.
In a lot of ways I am surprised more focus isn’t given to how Alto reacts to the songs. Specially when you consider a big part of Macross series as a whole is singing. Frontier in particular songs and in particular Aimo play a huge role within the storyline.
Reki said:
In addition in the movies Alto says several times how amazed he is by Sheryl’s abilities in concert like he is shown to be impressed by her singing and Sheryl is singing Aimo in his presence a lot. Yeah basically I agree, it’s not really obvious if you aren’t looking for it but the music of his love is shown to have an impact on him. It’s why I say Anata no Oto is also an important song and why the fact episode 25 is named Anata no Oto and she used it to turn the tides of battle so important.
angelfox22 said:
A lot of people just view the singing as background noise which is why Alto’s reaction to the songs is overlooked when taking anything into consideration but when you do it changes a lot of other stuff. It’s also one of the few things in Macross Frontier you can’t really debate over unlike certain conversations Alto has where it’s left open as to who he was meaning or what he wanted to really say. Which is why it’s a bit of surprise more don’t bring it up.
Reki said:
I really think that when I watched the first movie again how they messed with Aimo was the most indisputable change they did for showing how they changed Alto’s feelings. It’s a fairly obvious change and had no other real meaning behind it. Even people who didn’t get the meaning said it was stupid for Sheryl to have it and I don’t even think they even used it in the second movie if I remember right.
ramendik said:
Great to see we’re in the same place now about the love triangle. I tend to hold to Sheryl/Ranka as a trollish response to Kawamori’s trolling! (Well, you can’t really beat him as he was trolling in this direction too – just look at the official triangle, which happens to be equilateral).
Re Ranka and Episode 21, she was apparently acting without fully reaslizing what she was doing, at least she could not communicate things clearly to Alto. But I’ve already done the research (talked to a psychologist and to a couple of Macross fans who are teenage girls). This part is extremely realistic. It is the kind of emotional crisis that happens to a teenage girl. May have been influenced by Kawamori (or someone else on the team) witnessing these creatures in action. And yes, the way she was trapped is realistic, too.
I’m not sure Sheryl *could* have informed Ranka directly of Grace’s evil intentions by Episode 21 as she only learned about it in Episode 18. Does Sheryl have her mobile phone in the hospital? I don’t recall seeing it, and even if she did she seems to have forgotten about it entirely as she wandered the streets. Besides, as at the time resources on Frontier were getting rationed, might communications be disrupted? And I do not think Sheryl had any encounters with Ranka before Episode 21 except the one in Episode 20, but that was a hard moment, and even if Sheryl were to speak Ranka would not listen.
However Sheryl did have an encounter with Alto in Episode 19, but chose to be cryptic, “I will no longer sing” as opposed to “I used to sing but my manager played that dirty trick on me”. Does look like her bad – Alto would have conveyed the message to Ranka; whatever abut triangles he cared about her at least as a friend.
As for Sheryl giving up, it was probably their idea of character development. But it probably got loads of fan backlash and is very much “fixed” in the movies. “Don’t you understand, if I die, it must be on stage!”. I’d say movie!Sheryl is more Mary Sue-ish for it. Perhaps you’re right about swapping because, you know, when I tried an online “is your character Mary Sue” test on TV!Ranka, I got a very high Sue score.
By the way, re the movie changes – I’m afraid that’s just Kawamori being Kawamori. I mean. look at what he did to Misa Hayase in DYRL! In SDFM she was a highly competent military commander who would keep her cool even when captured by Zentradi; her sole moment of weakness on duty was on Mars with the Riber room, and even that was while she was sacrificing herself for the ship (she was trapped and her only alternative to romantic resignation would have been outright panic; she did not expect to be rescued). Then in DYRL, she *grabs Valkyrie controls from the rear without knowing how you do that, and very nearly kills herself and Hikaru*. What the … was that?!
But movie music, in my view, rocks. Niji Iro Kuma Kuma was already mentioned in comments. And whatever you think of any version of Sheryl, Universal Bunny is special… Again, this is Kawamori being Kawamori. The title song of “Do You Remember Love” became *the* Minmay song for a reason, defining the character and, from what I could find out, the real singer (to an extent she does not always appreciate).
Reki said:
Not sure I really made it clear the point of the love triangle trolling section was about but when the answers in the anime aren’t clear its always easy to take things a number of ways. Just annoying why everyone is so anal about it needing to be Sheryl and Alto when Kawamori at the very least obviously didn’t take it seriously if you really have to believe this is what happen. However I know there are other factors at work that cause people to be anal such as the idea that the series would be tainted or that Kawamori was doing something dishonest if it wasn’t suppose to be Sheryl x Alto. Well I still believe the movies are super tainted, along with other works post TV but I don’t blame Kawamori. Appears to me more like there was someone or some people within the staff that were anal about this but he more or less got the last troll in the movie and showed what his story was suppose to be subtly. I mean it wasn’t even his desire to not end the love triangle in the TV series so how can we be so sure anything else was his idea post TV series. That is how I see this all anyways without going into more details.
I would be completely 100% okay with one last troll in delta that was along the lines of like a 5 year old character that has the last name lee and has pinkish hair with red eyes and comes from a wealthy family but they never say who the parents are but I would more prefer they just leave it all alone.
As for Sheryl, sure she had her own things she was dealing with in ep 19 and 20 but I’m just saying if she was really as inspirational as people say she is she would have been more worried about telling people about Grace being untrustworthy than her own problems. Yes she should have told Alto at the very least in episode 19. It’s typical anime writing though, people never saying what they know to others unless they have all the answers. Heck she even saw Ranka on a big screen and instead of thinking oh I should be worried about her being with an untrustworthy Grace she instead collapsed being upset that Ranka was the people’s star not and not her. It doesn’t bother me at all, only bringing up the point that if you are going to criticize Ranka than maybe you should look at others too.
I really don’t see how Sheryl giving up at the end is character development though and even more annoyed they just randomly swapped it in the movies to Ranka giving up in the same spot for some stupid reason probably only to just keep the swap theme going.
In regards to the movie changes I’ve seen DYRL as well (even blogged it), I don’t feel what they did in that movie is even close to on par with all the crap they did to Frontier movies in my opinion.
Why is Universal Bunny special? I never paid close attention to it before.
Philip Elthorpe said:
From how I see the movie soundtrack, Universal Bunny is a damn good song, but nothing hugely ‘special’ IMHO.
I completely skip the first movie when watching them, and instead enjoy the epic win that is Niji Iro and the Alcatraz version of Seikan Hikou. In the second movie, the only songs in the Nyan Nyan Medley of note… are all original songs by them both.
Oh yes, Reki, Which is better? Macross’s Ranka… or Vocaloid’s GUMI?
Reki said:
not sure if I understand what you are asking but I like both Ranka and Gumi but Gumi is basically just a vocaloid made after Ranka so how can you not like the original the most.
ramendik said:
Er, wait. Ranka is a complete character written by a creative team, headed by Kawamori. GUMI is a ready-made “blank” character, designed for a voice synthesizer known as Megpoid and using the Vocaloid family of engines, released by Internet Co and intended for diverse use by a large number of creators. The two characters share the voice actor and the basic design.
I don’t see a way to compare the two (except some very superficial design differences, like those orange goggles GUMI has). Whatever the use, it’s usually one or the other. Except you can have both in a crossover.
(I actually did write a fanfic with GUMI getting created in the Macross-verse, using the chip that was fished out of defunct Sharon Apple at the end of Macross Plus; it’s an obvious sequel hook that was never used and I just don’t like the loss of Sharon. But that’s just fan fiction…)
ramendik said:
“Macross”, “Kawamori” and “take seriously” on one sentence appear to me to be a contradiction. This is a metaseries that pretty much started with a sequence of the destruction of the animation studio (I think it was in Episode 2 of SDFM).
It did go a bit more serious later, so it’s certainly not at the Lucky Star level, but it’s still never *completely* serious, it’s not Star Trek (though SDFM appears to reference Star Trek extensively) or Babylon 5. It’s a fun musical space opera, more or less aimed at a young adult primary audience. Macross 7 calculated its audience *too* young, resulting in the problems it had (my 9 year old son was just fine with those repeat battles thank you very much). Frontier made a much better shot.
So, yes, people in the fandom will be anal, because teenagers and people in their early 20s sometimes tend to have very strong opinions. It did not start with Frontier; the Minmay hatedom was apparently something to behold! I would see THIS as the reason behind the shipping wars. Some people like Sheryl, they, er, *want* Sheryl, and so they think they want her to win-at-everything. “Hopes and dreams” sums it up about right.
Well, that audience got their made-of-steel-kick-ass-Sheryl in the movies. Not the girl of Frontier TV who is shown to fail repeatedly (for example, when trying to pilot a Valkyrie).
I actually do think that her TV development has a point; she starts out overconfident, believing she achieved everything by her own mighty power and the world is her oyster, and that view gets dashed over pretty much the entire series. And she is a bad loser when she does lose. In TV, her overconfidence and then lack of resilience might be just as much of a problem as the virus; she does overcome them in Episode 21 but that’s just too late for Ranka.
(Wait, wait, was THAT the meaning behind Sheryl telling Alto to save Ranka?! It might not be about that darn triangle at all but about feeling guilty?)
I did not notice the point about warning Ranka before but it all seems to make sense now. When stressed out, *both* songstresses fail at communication. Sheryl fails to tell Alto, who does come to visit her, what really happened at the hospital. (Presumably she fails to tell Yasaburo, too; we do not see them conversing but somehow I think Yasaburo would have acted). Ranka calls Alto up in the middle of the night but, rather than explain her situation and idea, asks him about paper planes. Alto is left between two young women who just won’t talk to him properly.
And *ether* of them succeeding at communication would have derailed Grace’s evil plot.
Reki said:
Pretty sure what Sheryl says to Alto about saving Ranka is because she believes Alto loves Ranka and Sheryl is doing what is best for Alto knowing that he won’t be happy if he is stuck to the promise of having to stay with her until she dies. She says it several times before and after and I used screenshots of some of them in this post. I still don’t believe the words did much to him other then freeing him from a duty to her so he could focus more on Ranka.
As for Ranka failing to communicate in episode 21, she was about to say something to Alto when Ai-kun showed up and Alto tried to kill Ai-kun. I believe Ranka realized that trying to make him understand or others would be impossible at this point or at least could result in more bad things happening, she had to fix it all herself. In the end it worked out okay, I am not sure any other path taken would have really changed things. Brera was still mind controlled so he could have stolen Ranka at any time in his position. This just made it easier. I really didn’t want to criticize any of the actions, Sheryl could have done more but who knows if it would have done that much. I more just wanted to show some different perspectives you could see it from.
In regards to the trolling, yeah I know it’s not suppose to always be serious. I’m fine with what he does with the love triangle looking at it from a trolling perspective, at least to a point. I think Kawamori is better when he isn’t serious. That last anime he made, I forget the name it was such garbage, was way too serious. However I like Aquarion Evol and AKB0048 which is more fun and crazy.
ramendik said:
I did not even try watching AKB0048 because obvious commerce is obvious but perhaps I should. It’s Kawamori and they did not force him to be serious so even with the commercial constraints he could make it real fun. Come to think of it, Lucky Star, pretty much the definition of a fun-for-otaku anime, has a LOT of commercially inspired stuff in it.
Also – trolls. I love anime creators who are trolls. My main “idol” is Osamu Tezuka, who basically trolled the anime world into existance. And my main *active* “idol” is Gen Urobuchi, aka G-dd–ed Urobutcher. Kawamori fit into this line of trolls rather well.
Speaking of trolling, I just realized something. Sheryl and Ranka (TV. at least) are there as characters of different age groups. Even though their canonical age difference might be under two years, Ranka is a teenager and Sheryl is an adult. So Ranka is easier to relate for teenagers and Sheryl for adults.
I never even noticed Sheryl making some of her mistakes because I’d have made them too. I watched Frontier as a 30+ adult, and Sheryl was having the kind of crisis I can easily relate to (she is of course much younger but this stuff happens faster to pop singers – and sports professionals, I think). Ranka was having a crisis typical for a teenage girl, so I had to do a lot of research before I could have an idea what’s going on in Episode 21. (Things might have gone too far when Alto shot at Ai-kun, but before that happened Ranka spent a lot of time discussing paper planes in the middle of the night – was not easy for me to “get” that one).
Things get so darn easier when one stops viewing the canon as some sort of alternate world and starts thinking in terms of creative techniques and audiences.
Reki said:
AKB0048 is commercial but not much more than Macross is if you think about all the products it markets for *cough*yf-30. I think if you get past that its a lot of fun although season 2 not as much.
Green said:
Hello. I read your comments to macross frontier 2 years ago. When I was checking your website, I ve seen you put on a new one.
I am a real Ranka fan, even though I am a woman. Normally I don´t like every sweet girl. Ranka was one exception. She was cute, yes, but she had a lot of other qualities. I think a character who is still growing is very interesting. Weak and dependable, she was at first. She depended on Alto to much, but she grew out this dependance. She made her own choices, she became so strong. I love her tenderness. In my opinion she isn´t Mary Sue. She has a lot of flaws and a lot of good traits. Even Sheryl isn´t a Mary Sue. Besides she has a center role als the little Queen. That makes sense.
For Sheryl being the main character in the movies, well, that was a little bit more unreasonable ( in my opinion).
I don´t hate Sheryl. At first I didn´t like her. I thought that she was pretty annoying. Always being so forceful and bitchy. But I understand her a little better now. But I love Ranka still better.
Reki said:
Glad to hear your thoughts, I more or less feel the same way about Ranka and Sheryl. I was going to talk about that dependance Ranka had and grew out of more in my post but the post was getting to big as it was.
Iroha said:
I’m glad im not the only one depressed about Ranka’s ending